Courtly poetry, as I said, developed from the lyrics of the troubadours. Although there are many similarities, such as the woman's high status, there are also many dissimilarities. One of the most obvious of these is these poets acceptance of the real world. It is difficult to find references to other women in the troubadours' poetry let alone other relationships as one would find in

These conventions are a little different from those of the troubadours as well. The lady has hair of gold, a long neck, a slender waist and is often described as being prudent and wise. But these poems focus not on the lady but on the lover and his suffering for derne love or secret love. The lover's day is spent sighing and begging his lady to pity and have mercy on him. His night is spent lying awake, thinking unending thoughts of her. He often tells us that he feels condemned to death because his heart aches so badly for her.

The uncourtly poetry follows many of the same structural rules as the courtly but portrays women in a very different manner. The women of these poems can be divided into two groups, the married nag and the naive, unmarried maiden.

There is little of the intensity of devotion and the analysis of love that is characteristic of the Troubadours. Nor are these personal lyrics of private, intimate love. On the contrary, they are public poems operating through well-recognized conventions.

Besides being seen as promiscuous and naive, women were also seen as nagging, gossipy and stupid. There were several lyrics composed, more than likely in pubs or at male-gatherings for comedy, that warn against marriage and "cursed" women in general. The most blunt of these poems can be found in Luria's collection. The message is simply this, "Holde thine tunge stille / And have all thine wille"(61) or 'Keep your mouth shut'. This is a message that flows through all such poems. The men wish to do as they please and when their women tell them not to they complain that women are becoming too disobedient.

There are few similarities to be found between the courtly and uncourtly poetry. This is due mainly to the fact that there are so many conventions used in the courtly and so much freedom taken with the uncourtly view. But one of these few similarities can be found in the way women were seen and portrayed. Because all of the poems, courtly and uncourtly alike, were written by men, the women in the poems are very similar. In all but the last type of poem, the women were portrayed as meek, quiet, and obedient. In the mysogynistic poetry, the women's disobedience was subject of the poetry and she wasn't looked at very kindly. And in all of these poems the woman is made to seem rather dumb and illogical. There was no room left for individuality. So although the courtly may sound nicer, the view of women remains the same.

The latter are often the speakers of their poems. Usually they are lamenting over being abandoned by a lover and in worst case senerios are with child. They say they were promised love and loyalty, but once the lover had taken advantage of their innocence they were left alone

Some common words found in the essay are:
Luria Hoffman's, Troubadours Nor, , Middle English, courtly poetry, courtly uncourtly, poems woman, women poems, uncourtly poetry, women portrayed, warn marriage, luria's collection, developed lyrics, women seen,
Approximate Word count = 1854
Approximate Pages = 7 (250 words per page double spaced)